| Author |
Subject |
zambocello
Registered User
(9/11/00 2:11:06 pm)
Reply |
Chicago
Symphony Negotiations
David, Gary, et al -- can you
provide us with more info on the CSO negotiations? What are the
issues? CSO is one of the pace setters for the whole industry. Your
resolution will affect all of us.
I heard that Henry Fogel
felt the new hall was held hostage in the last negotiations. Is
there some payback at work here?
Whew! The previous political
thread had a life span of about 60 replies and the current one is
that old now. Maybe it's ready to sink into the virtual
sunset.
|
G
M Stucka
Registered User
(9/11/00 2:33:40 pm)
Reply |
Re:
Chicago Symphony Negotiations
Since I am not the "Voice of the
CSO" for this negotiation (the person who mans or womans the members
committee info line) I have ZERO inside info on negotiations. Also,
I don't feel that there are any special "punitive" agendas, at least
on the part of the orchestra membership. Frankly, I've not ever seen
this here from either side (David's been here MUCH (!!!!!! :>) )
longer than I and may have more accurate info). We've fought long
and hard to have a "flagship" contract and there's really no room
for such agendas in the face of the bigger and more important issues
that accompany every negotiation.
|
David
Sanders 
Registered User
(9/11/00 3:42:26 pm)
Reply |
Re:
Chicago Symphony Negotiations
No, I doubt if there are any
punitive issues from management's side.
As far as what the
issues are, we have a unique way of negotiating, in that we give
full authority to our committee not to come back with an offer until
it's something they feel they want to accept. It stops the
management from being able to nickle and dime the orchestra until
you get a settlement where it's a 50-47 vote (or something like
that). But to make it work, they don't discuss any of the
negotiating points, don't tell us what they're asking for, don't
tell us what has been offered. We just put our faith in them and
hope it works out. So far it has.
|
OyOy
Registered User
(9/11/00 4:00:53 pm)
Reply |
Re:
Chicago Symphony Negotiations
Interesting. So the CSO has never
voted down an offer that the committee passed on? And the committee
is empowered to wait managment out if they don't like an offer? Has
the committee ever passed on management's "best & final offer"
without endorsing it?
|
sarah
schenkman
Registered User
(9/11/00 5:42:34 pm)
Reply |
off
subject, but...
My orchestra's board (Savannah
Symphony) wants to bring Henry Fogel here as some sort of
facilitator - anyone have some idea if this is something that might
be good for the musicians to agree to? He doesn't want to come
unless we agree to it. I'd really like to hear from people with
Fogel experience.
|
zambocello
Registered User
(9/11/00 7:45:25 pm)
Reply |
Henry
Fogel as facilitator
I was in the Houston Symphony
1989-2000. (Just started out here in La La Land.) During that time
the Houston S.O. cultivated some horrendous problems. With no
solution in sight Henry was called in to help the organization find
a way. He led a self evaluation process that was very helpful.
I suspect the short answer at the Houston S.O. would be the
same as that at any orchestra with problems: "Yes, the management
and board have been underperforming. Yes, the musicians must be
patient while they learn what they are doing."
If your
orchestra is patient enough to go through a 1-2 year process and
wait who knows how many years for the desired results (presuming
that your organisation can and will improve itself) then the "Fogel
Process," as we called it in Houston, may be for you. If you want to
smack your employer up side the head with a labor action it's not
for you. I anticipate the political reality is that by entering into
anything like what we did in Houston a work action would leave the
musicians vulnerable to charges that you don't have the best
interest of the Symphony at heart since you sabotaged a genuine
effort to improve the organization.
I'm not sure what you
had in mind for Henry's involvement, so I'm not too sure all my
comments are pertinent.
I'd be interestd in learning more
about your situation and sharing more specifics about Henry's
involvement in Houston, if you'd like. Also, you could contact other
members of the Houston Symphony who were involved. (I was involved
up to my eye balls in HSO committee activites then.) Drop me an
email if you'd like. <zambocello@yahoo.com>
|
David
Sanders
Registered User
(9/11/00 8:45:24 pm)
Reply |
Re:
Chicago Symphony Negotiations
>So the CSO has never voted down
an offer that the committee passed on? And the committee is
empowered to wait managment out if they don't like an offer? Has the
committee ever passed on management's "best & final offer"
without endorsing it?
No, we've never voted down an offer
that the committee has passed on.
The committee has full power to
not give the orchestra an offer they don't like.
The
committee has passed on management's "best & final offer"
without endorsing it, every time just before a strike.
|
sarah
schenkman
Registered User
(9/12/00 6:00:12 pm)
Reply |
Chicago
Symphony Negotiations
What kind of timetable do you have?
Strike deadline? Are you still playing?
|
David
Sanders
Registered User
(9/12/00 11:42:36 pm)
Reply |
Re:
Chicago Symphony Negotiations
We haven't started playing yet.
There have been very few times that we've played and talked. It
never seems to work. We did a free for the city concert in Grant
Park before our last strike, then picked up the pickets and all
walked the 2 blocks to Orchestra Hall to start the picket line. But
in general, if we don't have a contract, we don't play.
And
it looks like we might not. We have a meeting tomorrow morning, and
we still don't know if it's at our hall (contract settled) or at the
Union hall (no contract). We've been told there are still big issues
that have not been settled (but we haven't been told what the issues
are). We'll probably find out the problems before we would take a
strike vote.
|
G
M Stucka
Registered User
(9/13/00 12:40:58 pm)
Reply |
CSO
settled at 7:30 am on 9/13. Contract ratified.
|
OyOy
Registered User
(9/13/00 12:49:36 pm)
Reply |
FABULOUS!!! Congratulations
Now you can take us all out to
dinner.
|
zambocello
Registered User
(9/13/00 12:58:01 pm)
Reply |
Congratulations
Now, the bad news is you have to go
to work!
(Happy greetings to Slidemaster from Jonathan K. and
Dale H.)
|
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